15 Ways to be Frugal

When my cousins and I were younger we’d joke about how our parents came up with different ways to be frugal. Words that came to mind when thinking about how they handled their money: stingy, cheap, a…

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Interview with Jordan Mara

Founder, Mind and Soil

I would like to introduce to you a lovely young man, Jordan Mara. I first met Jordan approximately three years ago, although it seems that I have known him longer. His mom and I are acquaintances, having graduated from the same Master’s Degree program many years ago. Jordan is the founder of Mind and Soil, which focuses on bringing the mental health and therapeutic benefits of gardening to people around the world.

What I find fascinating about Jordan is that he was formerly a corporate world guy, who now likes to play in the dirt. What makes a man go from decent earnings indoors on the carpet, to starting up a business outside in the garden? Let’s find out.

It all began with a breakup. Don’t most great stories do?

Jordan grew up in the White Rock/South Surrey area of British Columbia, Canada. He attended White Rock Elementary from kindergarten through grade 5, then went on to White Rock Christian School for grades 6 thru 12. At the University of Arizona on a Track and Field Scholarship, Jordan acquired a Bachelor of Science Degree in Business Administration, with a double major in Marketing and Entrepreneurship.

When I queried Jordan about his journey and arriving at Mind and Soil (great business name, by the way!), he told me that this evolution happened in three distinct phases: beginning his gardening journey, having his first garden [in Australia], and worm poop. Yup, you heard me right, worm poop.

Let’s back up and hear Jordan’s story.

In 2013 my gardening journey began. I was in the midst of a breakup; my first big heart break. I had ended things with my girlfriend at that time. I was having one of those moments of “oh shit, I made the wrong decision. I need to get her back. I cannot live as things are currently constructed.” Meanwhile she is “nope, I’m out the door, adios!”

Heartbroken was an understatement.

We had broken up, and I thought “shit, I have made the wrong decision.” I could not take my mind off of it. I just remember that stretch of time at work, and I had been so high performing up until that point. (Jordan worked one year for Nike, and then Hootsuite after that). Now I would be staring at my computer screen, but in a completely different world. Social instances as well. I would be talking and interacting, but not present at all.

Whenever I am anxious and in a bad headspace it all comes to a “T” when I try and go to sleep. Sleep, what is that?!

Perfect storm: break up, not sleeping, drank a whole bunch or smoked weed, anything to numb myself out. I was in a really shitty headspace.

I went for a visit to White Rock, either for Mother’s Day or my mom’s birthday. I went to sleep in the evening, tossed and turned all night, and eventually rolled over to the sun is rising (sigh).

That morning I was making myself a coffee and making a start to my day. My mom: “how did you sleep?” (I think the look on my face probably said it all) She paused, then said “why don’t we go out to the garden today?” I was “sure, ok, I guess, I don’t know, whatever…”

“Let’s just build a flower bed over here today. We will bring a bunch of river rocks over, we will have them flowing, bring in a bunch of dirt, and we will leave it at that for today. We don’t need to do anything more than that for the time being” says mom.

All right, cool.

I started grabbing the river rocks, bringing those over, bringing the soil over, and at some point in and amongst doing those pretty brainless activities of just bringing rocks over and bringing soil over, I so vividly remember being able to take a deep breath.

I describe it as when you are super anxious about something, and you have that tightness in your chest and the clamps on your neck? Then for the first time I could breathe. I don’t know what has just transpired in this little gardening session, but that feels really good!!

It was so relieving to feel a twinkle of self again; it’s going to be ok; it’s going to be ok. I felt a little bit more calm, a little bit more peaceful. Things are going to work out and be okay, I thought.

I could breathe again, but I also felt some hope. I felt things loosen a little bit.

I made a mental note: Oh, that’s gardening. Interesting.”

Thus Jordan’s gardening journey began.

Where I was living at the time I really didn’t have gardening space, then I moved to Australia. When I moved, I knew I wanted more gardening in my life.

I was looking at all of these apartments. I was moving to the other side of the world, by myself. I wanted to have a cool place. One day I was looking at several apartments in Sydney, going from one neighbourhood to the next. I came to this one neighbourhood and was walking down this little alley way, and I came to this loft apartment. I think this is it.

So it begins. The back patio area is where I had my first garden all to myself.

The important part that happened at this particular point in my journey wasn’t about having my own garden. In Australia, there was no composting. All kitchen waste went into the garbage. Every year I had set environmental goals for myself, and the previous year it was to start composting all my food scraps. Now I get to Australia and I can’t do that?! I didn’t just want to give up on that goal because they don’t have that here. I started researching to figure out how do you start composting at home? In a small space? Everything started pointing to worm farming. Huh?? Worm farming. I have never heard of this before.

I quite literally went down a worm hole of Youtube videos learning everything about worm farming. This is kinda interesting. What I learned during that is that the worms eat through the food, and the byproduct that they poop out is a worm casting, which is one of — if not the best — natural and organic fertilizers that exist.

Here is a life cycle example: I could potentially take something from my garden that I have grown, like a tomato. Eat 90% of it, and then take the top of it that I cut off and put it in my worm farm. They would eat that, turn it into amazing fertilizer, and I can then put that back into the garden, which is going to grown into another tomato…and it is all staying right here!

So I got a worm farm, and it was like bringing a baby home. Everybody in Cat Alley was, Wow! You love this thing so much. I was doing demos, I was explaining it to people, everybody could just see how much it lit me up. What I loved about it was how it closed the loop, and in a small apartment, I could keep everything going there. Later on, it has now turned into Mind and Soil.

That level of fascination was super cool and powerful. What was crazy was that my mom and dad came to visit me in 2016, and of course I had to show them my worm farm. It was my pride and joy. There I was, their 28 year old who living on the other side of the world, with really good earnings at that point in time, my apartment was stunningly beautiful…cozy, quaint, and charming. I was winning. Then, the worm farm, lol. It was the biggest piece. So much so, that if I ever had a date and they came to my apartment…you gotta see the worm farm!

Showing my parents the worm farm in 2016, my mom mused: “I’ve got a feeling that this is going to be something bigger for you; something big.” My thought process? I hope so.

I was really fascinated by the concept of how something that is being thrown out or potentially wasteful, when re-processed (in this instance by worms but it’s not dissimilar to up-cycling clothing) is all of a sudden incredibly valuable to individuals. That’s an amazing win-win scenario.

The third key phase definitely wasn’t one specific moment that occurred, but just a shift that I could feel happening in my life. I left Australia in 2017 and I knew that I wanted to go down the entrepreneurial path. In August I left my good corporate job and I did some travelling before ending up back in Vancouver in March of 2018.

After I left Hootsuite, I started my own sales consulting business and within 12 months I had signed a book of business that was just under $300k annually. I launched late 2017, and this occurred by the end of July 2018. A profitable endeavour, but I knew I would now have to bring in some consultants to take some the work off of my plate. That would mean it morphs from just me into a team of 3 or 4 or 5 consultants that I would put onto these businesses. I wasn’t drawn to that. I discovered something lucrative, but no passion. I could see that in three years there could be ten of us, and we might be doing over $1 million worth of business. But I don’t need even as much as I am earning right now? And I would have to work even harder to get to that point. I don’t care about those things.

It was clear that the next step would be to bring on more people and work, but intuitively it was also clear that this was not the path that I wanted to go down. It was clear to me that I was not excited in a way that I should be about this. I chatted with one of my mentors, and was explaining my predicament. He explained that whatever I was doing professionally was ultimately to give yourself the financial resources to have the freedom to do whatever you want with your life. Whether that is being philanthropic, or travelling the world, or raising a family, or building a business empire and taking on new business endeavours. So what is the life that you want to fuel/create? It occurred that I hadn’t thought about that at all!! Which is probably why I was having such a tough time, lol.

So rather than going down the path of hiring, I actually put everything on hold. For 2019 I told all of my customers that I was taking the first chunk of the year as a sabbatical to start figuring out what I wanted. I knew that whatever I was doing professionally I was only wanting to do it 4 days a week, and reserving one day per week to begin exploring into the mental health world and what role I’d be playing in that world and how I would transition more and more of my time toward that.

How did you make the leap from business toward mental health?

Partially the moment in the garden with mom. Partially as I was having more and more conversations with people where they are struggling with this or with that. My favourite quote in the whole world is “Be Kind. Period. Everybody is fighting in a fight club that you know nothing about because we don’t talk about fight club.” For me that was so true in my own life, and in so many interactions that I was having with people. I’m really hurting, you are really hurting, this person is really hurting, and it is not normal to talk about or feel this way. You shouldn’t feel that way because you are weird or crazy or having a tough stretch or having a battle internally.

I have always felt that I haven’t had a huge fear of being the first one to jump. I don’t know if this person is struggling with something right now or not, so if I share something that I am struggling with, then that has now created a safe space for them to start talking. So I am just going to start leading, being more open, more vulnerable with the things that are going on in my life. This is what starts the conversations.

I feel a duty or responsibility to be doing that in my life. To be fearless to be the first one through the door, to face whatever is on that side of the door. Because I know that there are so many other people that want to go through whichever door it is, but don’t have the confidence or the courage to open the door themselves. But if someone else opens it, they will gladly walk through it, and walk into a much better room.

Just building a business solely based on profit doesn’t resonate with me because that is so much of our living time and energy that is only going to one singular focus. There are so many bigger pieces to be working on in the world.

For example, take Warren Buffet or the Bill Gates archetype: build a huge profit engine that you can then direct at the other areas that matter to you. It is noble and wonderful because it is having profound impacts in the world. That is one option, but there are others. What is the path that resonates with you? For myself, that was dedicating one day per week into the mental health world, while still dedicating the other four days per week a solid income, earnings and security — working for one of my customers.

My one measure of success on my Fridays was “did that energize me?” When I left the day, was that cool what I worked on? Or, it was interesting, but my soul is not on fire.

So started with what I knew best — the technology world. I started looking at all of the mental health technologies and applications that existed out there. People who had struggled themselves and were trying to monetize their ideas. It was okay, but still not what really excited me. I let that go.

My personal theory on what follows is that when we get to the weekend we bury our heads into our phones and time is just passing by as opposed to recharging our batteries. So when we use indirect attention, mindless activities like drawing or colouring or gardening, all of a sudden we are away from where we have been working. We are fascinated by what we have been doing, and we feel like we have been on a mini vacation. Now we get to Sunday and we feel that we are again ready to go for what is next in our life.

What I took from researching Attention Restoration Theory is exactly how I felt when I gardened. I would spend an hour in the garden, and I would be happier. Conversations that I would have with my partner at the time would be way smoother, I was way more empathetic, way more loving, and everything in my life would just be better.

I didn’t see myself going down the therapy path, becoming a Nature-based Therapist. I let that flow go out, but decided that I am bringing with me the concept of Attention Restoration Theory.

Then lockdown happened, Covid. I wanted to bring some kind of joy or happiness to people so I started posting this thing called Soil Saturday on my Instagram account about whatever I was working on in the garden. This became my Friday now. Sharing my love of gardening with people on my Instagram account.

The first thing that I worked on was literally building a hot compost pile. People connected with it. They loved the trial and the error and they could see how emotionally invested I was, trying to get it to 80 degrees Fahrenheit (which is not that hot at all). We finally got to that point after updating everyone every week on what the temperature was, and what I was shifting and changing in order to try and get it to that temperature. Finally, we got to 80F and I got a bottle of champagne. I poured a glass for myself, poured a glass for the pile, and had a huge celebration! I could tell this was lighting my soul on fire.

Gardening is lighting my soul on fire, and what it is doing to me mentally is that it is restoring me. Completely rejuvenating me so that I can be my best self in the other avenues of my life. I hypothesized that I could bring that to other people. How do I do that? Worm castings.

So the next thing I started posting in Soil Saturdays was the AB Test Results with seedlings that would have received my worm castings, and seedlings that just had a store bought fertilizer. People then started asking, how do I buy that? How can I get my hands on some of these for my garden beds. Holy shit, this can actually now become something. I can now bring the healing powers of gardening to people through these absolutely amazing natural and organic worm castings, which will give the business the financial fuel to bring this to even more individuals all throughout the world. That was basically how Mind and Soil got started!

How did you come up with the name of your organization?

Name, a small and simple thing, but so important.

Now that I had made the decision that I am going to create a gardening business that focuses on bringing the mental health benefits of gardening to individuals, I need a name.

Building a business, my view on it, is very much that it is similar to raising a child or, if nothing less, an entity of consciousness.

Mind and Soil did not exist in any way shape or form until I had that moment in 2013 with heart break, that moment in 2016 with my worm bin, and that moment in 2019/2020 of it all starting to come together. That’s all happening purely within my sphere, my world.

At a certain point it then birthed. That is the launch of Mind and Soil. I was also aware that I could become the limiting factor on it too. If all of a sudden my baby needs to go to school, it is going to be influenced by its teacher, and it is going to begin to morph and evolve and change based off of the influence of the world around it as opposed to its sole creator. So very early on, I had in the back of my mind that there is a role for me to play with Mind and Soil, but I am also not the single individual that is going to influence it. So I want to be open to working in partnership with the other influences that will come in and that it will interact with. As opposed to “I know exactly the direction that it is supposed to go”.

Naming it is a good example. Tapping into general public consciousness, I asked people who had be following me on Instagram. They had a feel for it. I polled people, did a spreadsheet, worked with a marketing person. Growmantic? Planthood? Heart and Soil? Mind and Soil?? There were many great ideas that emerged. The URL for Mind and Soil happened to be available, the Instagram account was available, the Facebook page was available, the Shopify page was available. Hmmmm. With all of the other names, one of those things was missing so we would have to make a variation. That was interesting.

To make my decision, I went camping with my dad and brothers. On the trip, Mind and Soil became very clear. That is it! This is the culmination of so many years of my subconscious figuring it out and piecing it together. For me, it is bringing the mental health benefits of gardening to people. Mind and Soil puts that front and centre. I wanted the mindfulness side, the mental well-being side, front and centre of what it is that we are doing.

I could feel myself grappling with the fact that this is something that I am birthing, and that I have kind of raised until this point, and how do I allow other individuals to come into the picture and influence the way that it will be raised? I knew that I needed to still hold onto it pretty tightly at this point (choosing the name). All of the designs: the lettering, the logos, the illustrations, all of the colours….I handed that to my design agency. And I love what they have done.

Moving forward, what kind of plans do you have for Mind and Soil?

A question that I have: How do you help people tap into that gardening magic? How do they easily experience that moment that I experienced in 2013?

At this point what I keep coming back to is that the magic is there — in the gardening. For those who are open to it, it’s going to happen if they are able to get themselves into the garden. So what could be preventing them from getting into the garden? They don’t know what to be buying, so they could be buying the wrong products. And, they don’t know what to do once they get out there. No education around it. There is my work!

Everything that I am focusing on at this point in time is what products you need, and how to be using them. So when you do get to that time — starting your seeds, transplanting into your pots or into your garden beds, growing your plant, pruning it, harvesting it — you aren’t wondering what to do. Rather, I watched that video from Jordan yesterday so now I know exactly what I have to do. And I’ve got the video right here if I need to relate back or think through any other area.

My belief is that the mental health benefits of gardening are here, and the starting point to gardening is there. Between here and there is a bit of a learning curve where people are going to feel uncomfortable. They are not going to feel confident, and when you feel uncomfortable and you don’t feel confident doing something for the first time, you are stressed. The role that I see Mind and Soil playing is flattening that learning curve, and reducing it, so that the time it takes to tap into that completely euphoric relaxed state is as short as possible.

We don’t want the stress of the unknown to counteract against what it is that we are trying to accomplish in the first place, which is trying to help people with their mental health.

Trying anything new for the first time can be a bit overwhelming. How can we make that as small to non-existent as possible? If we can do that, we are then freeing up the gardening to do its thing.

I don’t want to try and muck around with the magic that the garden has on its own. No two gardens are alike. No two people are alike. That’s the side that I want to just unfold as it is meant to for that individual. For one individual it might be that their stress has reduced by just getting their hands in the soil. It could be for another individual that mucking around in the soil didn’t do anything for them, but seeing that seed poke through the ground and begin to grow has helped them process grief, or?? It has so many different ways that it can be impactful for an individual, but it will be unique because the individual interacting with it as the interface is different in every instance. I don’t want to tell you what it’s going to bring to you. You know why you’re going into the garden. You know why you were open to trying out Mind and Soil, or to try gardening for the first time. There is something that you’re hoping that it brings to you. When the individual is leading with that, that’s when it is most powerful. As opposed to “follow these easy steps, and you will be less anxious” lol. Instead, follow these steps, and then tell me how it was.

What’s it like for you now, to see your baby growing?

I think there are moments of fear, and moments of overwhelm. I am not a classically trained gardener. I don’t come from a horticultural background. I am actually doing a Master Gardener program right now to help with that, and to ease my imposter syndrome!!

There is also a fear that people will find an even higher performing product, and will shit on Mind and Soil, and everything goes down the drain.

In any of those moments I come back to “what are you doing?” I want to bring that mental health and that therapeutic side to as many people as possible. That centres me immediately.

I have an incredible sense of peace and I have had it for the past six or seven months, which is an extremely long period of time for me (to feel this way). Whatever it is that this is going to evolve into, it very much feels like I have found my life’s work. The thing that I am going to be pouring years and years into.

This is interesting to me because it isn’t that I think I have found an opportunity that is going to become a ten plus million dollar business. Rather, just stay on the short and narrow path, and execute, execute, execute! Then I may end up rich and wealthy and all of that. Maybe. However that’s the furthest thing from my mind. It’s so nice to just feel that I am on the path.

I have so often thought about my life as being on a path and trying to get to the top of a mountain. The path is clearly marked right now. I’ve got very high levels of clarity. But there are going to be times where the path is a little bit overgrown; or there’s gonna be times that there’s a washed out river that’s coming through the path; or there’s gonna be times where it’s a scramble to get through. Those are going to be the moments that challenge me.

Redefine direction, possibly? But also grow my character at that point.

There will probably also be moments where I am going down a certain path and realize that it is going to the wrong area! I am giving myself permission to have that side as well. I know that Mind and Soil is representative of a mountain, and I am on that path. When you think about it, the amount of time that you spend on the summit is a percentage point of the total time of the journey.

I have a great sense of peacefulness in this moment. It’s really nice to know that I am no where near the peak. I am at the very beginning where it is still flat, but I’m loving it. I’m going to soak that up as much as possible. Arrive at the summit when we arrive at the summit. Figure out what to do from there.

I struggle a bit, not coming from a clinical background. What does the mental health offering of Mind and Soil evolve into? I do have this great sense of peace that that part will evolve and grow as it’s meant to. It’s on my mind enough that I know it’s there, but the next evolution on that front isn’t needed so imminently that I need to be focused on it. Let the subconscious marinate on it for a little while and the same kind of uh-huh moment that has happened with the worm castings or the name Mind and Soil, that’s going to come to be when it’s meant to be. I can tell by how much my mind thinks about it, and I can tell how pure the intention of the business is that it is only a matter of time until the pieces start coming together on that front.

One thing that has always been a belief of mine is that it is not one size fits all. For example, I love journalling. Journalling is the best way to pump things out of my brain. It might not be for you though.

The same is true for gardening. I hope that it has an amazing impact for all who try it. But I also know that for some people it’s going to work amazingly, and for other people they might say “I gave it a try, and it wasn’t the thing for me”. They are going to continue along in their own journey. I do hope that people can find that thing that gives them what they need.

Where do you see yourself at 50?

Myself at 50 years old: I love my time by myself, I never wear gloves, I am always getting my hands dirty. I come out of an hour of gardening and it’s like: “were you the same person that was here an hour ago?? Where did the other guy go? He disappeared.”

If you would like the opportunity to learn from Mind and Soil yourself, feel free to reach out to Jordan and begin your garden therapy.

15 Ways to be Frugal

Interview with Jordan Mara

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